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#1386979 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:55 am

Both the Solid Potential as well as the Lower Profitability bring up some of the same kwds. How could that be? Aren't the two tasks mutually exclusive? The S P indicates creating content for those kwds first, while the L P indicates deleting those or creating content for them last....

#1386989 by Juri from
Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:51 pm

Hi Jacob,

Both tasks are made up of two filters being applied to your keywords in sequence. One of those, for Value Demand, is exclusive [highest 60% vs lowest 30%], while the other, for Real Supply, is not [range between 20% and 80% vs highest 50%].

The order in which the filters are applied is important, that is, applying them in a different order will result in a different result set. With the filter on VD applied first, you'd get different results for both tasks, as this first step would produce sets with keywords exclusive to each task.

Instead, it seems that the filter on RS is applied first. This leaves many keywords in both result sets after the first step [those with RS between 50% and 80%]. Since VD score is independent from RS for the same keyword, the next step won't make results mutually exclusive.

TLDR: The order in which the filters are applied makes the difference. With VD filter applied first, results wouldn't contain any matching keywords.

    You can try it yourself in MKL by clicking on Filter to make the conditions visible, and changing them in sequence.
Kind regards,
#1386992 by Mary from Mico
Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:45 pm
Hi Jacob.

I'm thankful Juri wrote his good post.

Another thing to remember about the Profitability column is that a keyword may not be "profitable" traffic wise, yet purchase wise it might be quite $ profitable.

Another thought is that since BI takes info from many sources and through the different seasons, what looks like low profitability in the fall may have a much higher profitability in another season.

'Just some ideas.

Happy Thanksgiving!

#1386997 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:23 pm
Hi Juri, Mary,

Thanks for responding. I do have a hard time making sense of this, as the Tasks descriptions have clear indications: "create...first..." "either delete, or create last...", so what difference does it make which way I sort the kwds by demand, supply or else??

#1386999 by Juri from
Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:04 pm
Jacob, don't despair. First of all, these are just numbers. They are meant to serve as an aid to make your decisions. Don't overestimate them.

Second, to follow up on your original question, keywords which end up in both result sets do have a rather high supply [as mentioned above, they have an RS higher than that of half of your MKL], and thus can be deemed quite competitive. Even if their VD is high enough to qualify for Solid Potential, they are probably not that valuable. You don't have to delete them if you think they are good possible topics, but they don't require an immediate action either.

Concentrate on keywords with, say, VD > 100 and 10 < RS < 100, and use your own judgement to rate them. Check pages returned by SE for them. What search intent do they imply? Can you do better?

There are quite a few resources around, in both TNT and Forums, on how to work with MKL. But again, don't let numbers decide alone.

Kind regards,
#1387001 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:26 pm
Thanks for taking the time to respond and help. I have been using the SBI tools and help for many years and have read most of the TNT, some of it many times over and experienced a lot.

Recently I have decided to put more efforts in restructure, so am trying to make use now of the various tasks and filters in addition to judging the kwds myself and making use of various tools and techniques besides sbi.

The mkl tools bug me, especially that it seems to be very unstable. I had several instances just now getting totally different results just by choosing the very same tools different times. Tuesday I had a whole bunch of kwds in the Most Money task. I compared and marked each of those on a sheet with the names of the pages that I have created so far, and most of the pages kwds were in this category. There was a lot of thought, work and time involved in doing this.

One day later, yesterday, the Most Money is empty, no single kwd qualifies... Hard work wasted away.

Yesterday, I did a SP and a LP check, got a number of kwds, some of which appeared in both tasks, which is contradictory as I have already described. It is true, we have to use our own understanding and not rely blindly on the tools, but if the tools are not useful at all and the indications to create content for one kwd first, for the other last or delete, if this indications can't be counted on at all, so what's the point??

Guess what, looking today at both the tasks again, there's not single kwd appearing twice, they are in either one, not in both. No more contradiction. Yesterday I exported the results of both tasks, so I have proof of my claims, and I did the hard work for these too, adding the respective mark, L P or S P near each page that I have created. Today that the results differ as mentioned -- more hard work and time wasted... I was going to consider the use of those tools and plan extensively. Don't know what to trust there anymore....

#1387002 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:39 pm
I just solved one part, the contradicting results of yesterday and today. Turns out when all kwds are selected it yields one set of results and when a certain seed word is selected results would be different.

Still, the main problem isn't solved which is when one seed one is selected, the one that is currently most important to me, and the same kwd again pops up in both contradictory tasks, the Solid Potential as well as the Lower Profitability with their polar suggestions.

#1387005 by Juri from
Thu Nov 23, 2017 8:13 pm
Jacob from Fort Kent Mills wrote:Still, the main problem isn't solved

Yes, I understand how this can be disturbing. Perhaps it would be a good idea to let Support know, just by referencing them to this thread.

In the meantime, you can recreate the tasks manually in order to get mutually exclusive results:
  • select your seed word
  • click on Filter
    To get Solid Potential:
  • use highest 60% for VD
  • use percent range from 20% to 80% for RS
    To get Low Profitability:
  • use lowest 30% for VD
  • use highest 50% for RS
This is guaranteed to be mutually exclusive, as long as you apply filters in this order, but not necessarily has the same "search intent" as the preconfigured tasks.

Kind regards,
#1387007 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Thu Nov 23, 2017 8:38 pm

Did just that, referenced them :)

This precisely is the mystery here. The percentages you indicated are pre determined filters for the given tasks. They should be mutually exclusive, indeed. Yet they appear in both....

#1387011 by Jeff from
Fri Nov 24, 2017 1:55 am
Hi Jacob. The Lower Profitability task picks the highest 50% Real Supply (that is, all the keywords from the highest supply to the literal midrange (50%) of supply). The Solid Potential task picks all the keywords in the 20% to 80% range. 20% to 80% includes 50.01% to 79.99% (a subset of the keywords brought back by the LP task).

Therefore, there's a 30% overlap between the two tasks, for supply only.
#1387012 by Jacob from Fort Kent Mills
Fri Nov 24, 2017 2:15 am
Hi Jeff,
This is also what Support explained to me, and per their suggestion I have decided to go with SP when there's a conflict, unless common sense and industry knowledge point otherwise.

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